"Chinese personality is very conservative. They are traditionally and typically risk takers." A FCII told me.
We love gambling and hate insurance. So what do you think?
I think that's quite right, on a general scale.
mosquito
2 Mar 2005, 11:33
| QUOTE (GISS @ 2 Mar 2005, 11:15) |
"Chinese personality is very conservative. They are traditionally and typically risk takers." A FCII told me. We love gambling and hate insurance. So what do you think? |
Conservative and risk taker? aren't they very different and just like a dilemma?
| QUOTE (mosquito @ 2 Mar 2005, 11:33) |
| Conservative and risk taker? aren't they very different and just like a dilemma? |
i'm confused as well. who can explain that?
Paradox does exist in our society.
Being conservative, traditional and risk taker can refer to different aspects. E.g. on the one hand, when talking about family and relationship, we are relatively conservative and traditional in comparison to the west(well I hope); then on the other hand, when talking about gambling, insurance willingness and minor offence of regulations such as cheating in an exam etc, we are risk takers.
| QUOTE (GISS @ 2 Mar 2005, 11:36) |
| QUOTE (mosquito @ 2 Mar 2005, 11:33) | | Conservative and risk taker? aren't they very different and just like a dilemma? |
i'm confused as well. who can explain that? |
Just consider the food Chinese and Engish eat.
Chinese are risk takers and English are conservative.
babylove
2 Mar 2005, 15:08
because what?
no job? no money!no good benefit!no good life!---------so we are high risk taker!
Salisbury
2 Mar 2005, 22:32
| QUOTE (mosquito @ 2 Mar 2005, 11:33) |
| QUOTE (GISS @ 2 Mar 2005, 11:15) | "Chinese personality is very conservative. They are traditionally and typically risk takers." A FCII told me. We love gambling and hate insurance. So what do you think? |
Conservative and risk taker? aren't they very different and just like a dilemma?
|
We are conservative does not necessarily mean 'we are cautious'.
I think the commenter meant 'Chinese people would like to conserve our risk-taking tradition'.
| QUOTE (Salisbury @ 2 Mar 2005, 22:32) |
| I think the commenter meant 'Chinese people would like to conserve their risk-taking tradition'. |
i don't think so.
鉴于我外语不好,我说中文
我觉得他是指,中国人保守,宁可把钱放在自己的口袋里,不愿意为未来可能发生的accident支付一点小钱,这就象gambling把钱压在最好结果上
So what do you think?
good point, strongly agree
Salisbury
2 Mar 2005, 22:55
| QUOTE (GISS @ 2 Mar 2005, 22:44) |
| QUOTE (Salisbury @ 2 Mar 2005, 22:32) | | I think the commenter meant 'Chinese people would like to conserve their risk-taking tradition'. |
i don't think so. 鉴于我外语不好,我说中文 我觉得他是指,中国人保守,宁可把钱放在自己的口袋里,不愿意为未来可能发生的accident支付一点小钱,这就象gambling把钱压在最好结果上 So what do you think?
|
Your understanding is quite reasonable...it does make sense to me...I do not know now....it is better to know context as well.
Maybe you should ask the sayer what s/he meant...
forbetterlife
2 Mar 2005, 23:00
| QUOTE (GISS @ 2 Mar 2005, 22:44) |
| QUOTE (Salisbury @ 2 Mar 2005, 22:32) | | I think the commenter meant 'Chinese people would like to conserve their risk-taking tradition'. |
i don't think so. 鉴于我外语不好,我说中文 我觉得他是指,中国人保守,宁可把钱放在自己的口袋里,不愿意为未来可能发生的accident支付一点小钱,这就象gambling把钱压在最好结果上 So what do you think?
|
觉得这位的理解正确
I just want to know the perception of and attitude to risks from a Chinese perspective. So his opinion is not that important.
how can the insurance industry change ppl's attitude to risks and insurance?
| QUOTE (GISS @ 2 Mar 2005, 23:09) |
I just want to know the perception of and attitude to risks from a Chinese perspective. So his opinion is not that important.
|
SchwierigSeele
3 Mar 2005, 17:59
What I think is 'you don't want to lose a penny from your pocket' doesn't mean you are risk taking, since he/she may have better solutions to protect him/her self.
BTW, insurance does not protect a person physically and infact they just give you some money while you're in trouble. Lots of people lost their sense of 'in-danger' after purchasing an insurance because they think they're being protected, and this would surely put them to an even risky condition. Am I right?
| QUOTE (SchwierigSeele @ 3 Mar 2005, 17:59) |
| Lots of people lost their sense of 'in-danger' after purchasing an insurance because they think they're being protected, and this would surely put them to an even risky condition. Am I right? |
cos premium depends on the record of your claim history, you have to protect you or your property. safety management is another solution. but some disasters are out of control, e.g. 911 and tsunami.
SchwierigSeele
3 Mar 2005, 18:33
but I think it's less likely that the western people judge the chinese people as risk takers because they always expecting a 911 or tsunami.
| QUOTE (SchwierigSeele @ 3 Mar 2005, 18:33) |
but I think it's less likely that the western people judge the chinese people as risk takers because they always expecting a 911 or tsunami. |
do you know some british insurance companies ended cover of flood due to its high frequency?
insurance is not something to cover high-frequency risks.
SchwierigSeele
3 Mar 2005, 23:10
| QUOTE (GISS @ 3 Mar 2005, 18:44) |
do you know some british insurance companies ended cover of flood due to its high frequency? insurance is not something to cover high-frequency risks. |
This is exactly what I want to say. As insurance is not something to cover high-frequency risks, so there's no big difference between an insuranced people and non-insuranced people.
sonychen
4 Mar 2005, 18:33
blame the risk maker
SchwierigSeele
4 Mar 2005, 19:01
hey man, the risk maker could be nature itself. How to complain?
This is exactly what I want to say. As insurance is not something to cover high-frequency risks, so there's no big difference between an insuranced people and non-insuranced people. [QUOTE]
Logical mistakes. Whether or not the insurance is useful depends on the your fortune and luckiness. If you get injured but have no money to be cured, you will be regret for your choices for the rejection of insurances.
YO TE AMO
21 Apr 2005, 8:10
| QUOTE (SchwierigSeele @ 3 Mar 2005, 17:59) |
What I think is 'you don't want to lose a penny from your pocket' doesn't mean you are risk taking, since he/she may have better solutions to protect him/her self.
BTW, insurance does not protect a person physically and infact they just give you some money while you're in trouble. Lots of people lost their sense of 'in-danger' after purchasing an insurance because they think they're being protected, and this would surely put them to an even risky condition. Am I right? |
I agree with you
as i see it diffierent person have diffierent opinion
somebody like use money gamble
Cause they think if they have a good luck, they could win more money
and they didn't think much about their future
Somebody like to purchase insurance
Cause they think it is safer than gamble
and also they think much about their future
High Frequency Risk?
You can have High Risk or you can have High Frequency, the above just makes no sense.
In every culture, some people are risk-averse, some are not.
The behaviour, though, depends on the upbringing and economic condition.
In this country, for example, many people are against the tuition-fees and student-loans. In the US however going into student debt is seen as an investment. Perception will change over time, across all cultures.
janesophie
27 Apr 2005, 23:44
We can't take it for granted that every Chinese is risk-takers. Risk is perceptive, hence everyone has different definition of risk. Risk attitudes, however, would reflect a range of subjective values, cultural experience being one of which. My professor took a research in the 80s and found that Asians (Chinese, Malaysian and Hong Kong) are not inclined to think in terms of probability, in other words, they are not used to assessing risk in analytical way. I rather agree that when thinking risks, we are more relying on our intuitive sense rather than algorithms. It is not a good thing or bad thing, but just a pattern that we perceive risk. But again, culture is not the driving force for individual behaviour. So I should warn you here not to fit people you meet into their cultural stereo types.
The fact that Chinese like gambling does not prove anything in terms of risk-attitude. How much you are willing to lose in comparison with your possession in a gamble should be the ultimate test for risk-attitude.
Insurance is another controversial topic. I guess people who buy insurance for the first time percieve risk to be at a higher level than actual risk. So they are expecting a high compensation for their loss. However, for insurances that you buy as a habit, typically car insurance. There is a common pitfall that people always claim every damage incurred to their cars, without realising that the price will be going up according to the number of their claims.
用经济学上的adverse selection理论来说,那个FCII的陈述是因为他没有低索赔的中国人群做他的客户。
| QUOTE (qcyshh @ 2 May 2005, 22:13) |
用经济学上的adverse selection理论来说,那个FCII的陈述是因为他没有低索赔的中国人群做他的客户。 |
Long time no see.
Has the wedding bell rang yet?
You two should come around for tea sometime.
We are learning very hard in the Second Classroom how to behave like British.
Wedding seems not very fashionable nowdays. We'll give it a rain check.
Old fashioned scone and tea is still someone's favourite though.
| QUOTE (qcyshh @ 2 May 2005, 21:13) |
用经济学上的adverse selection理论来说,那个FCII的陈述是因为他没有低索赔的中国人群做他的客户。 |
The insurance industry can also face problems of signaling and screening. People who buy insurance often have a better idea of the risks they face than do the sellers of insurance. People who know that they face large risks are more likely to buy insurance than people who face small risks. Insurance companies try to minimize the problem that only the people with big risks will buy their product, which is the problem of adverse selection , by trying to measure risk and to adjust prices they charge for this risk. Thus, life insurance companies require medical examinations and will refuse policies to people who have terminal illnesses, and automobile insurance companies charge much more to people with a conviction for drunk driving.
中国保险市场有两个问题,依本人愚见
1. excesses/deductibles
The reasons for excesses are twofold: firstly to eliminate small claims, where administration costs often can exceed the claimed amount itself; and secondly, to ensure that the insured will comply with his obligation to avoid claims by taking all reasonable precautions to prevent loss or damage.
| QUOTE |
| http://www.qianlong.com/ 2004-11-03 08:27:48 11月2日下午,被公众指责推出“霸王条款”的中国人民财产保险股份公司打破沉默,紧急为自己辩解:是否使用车损险免赔额条款由客户自己选择,不是强制性的,我们的新条款不是霸王条款。 |
excesses/deductibles在中国还不被广泛接受,所以造成了很多中国客户索赔,这与保户对风险的认识,市场游戏规则有关
2. 没有Claims Experience, insured不在乎索赔,也不注意risk prevention measurers
另外,那位人士做的不是车险和寿险,在其context下不存在低索赔
| QUOTE (janesophie @ 27 Apr 2005, 23:44) |
| The fact that Chinese like gambling does not prove anything in terms of risk-attitude. How much you are willing to lose in comparison with your possession in a gamble should be the ultimate test for risk-attitude. |
麻烦解释一下
| QUOTE (SchwierigSeele @ 3 Mar 2005, 23:10) |
| This is exactly what I want to say. As insurance is not something to cover high-frequency risks, so there's no big difference between an insuranced people and non-insuranced people. |
至少转移对财产损失的恐惧,也是benefit之一
| QUOTE (gla @ 20 Mar 2005, 5:58) |
| Logical mistakes. Whether or not the insurance is useful depends on the your fortune and luckiness. If you get injured but have no money to be cured, you will be regret for your choices for the rejection of insurances. |
其实insurance和gambling没什么区别,大伙给一个人凑分子,负责忙活的收点服务费
| QUOTE (Fire @ 21 Apr 2005, 10:39) |
High Frequency Risk?
You can have High Risk or you can have High Frequency, the above just makes no sense. |
FYI
http://www.casact.org/lists/casnet/00000432.htmThe amount assigned to a policy should be a function of the risk associated with writing the policy, and will change over time as the risk changes. At first, the risk will include event risk. Examples of event risk include:
. Catastrophe risk
. Large loss risk (such as a fire at a major resort leading to a large number of suits and injured parties)
.
High frequency risk as was seen in 1984 for WC, when an expanding economy led to an increased use of inexperienced workers and higher WC accident rate.
刚才问过老外了,说确实用法不对,Internet害人阿,到底谁第一个说的
frequently risks
| QUOTE (yoda @ 21 Apr 2005, 20:15) |
| In every culture, some people are risk-averse, some are not. |
跟没说一样
我没有好好学习insurance market,只是挺喜欢你的这个Chinese are risk-takers的标题,所以进来掺和了一下。
我指的低索赔是索赔金额和索赔概率之积比较低的意思,倒是没有那么specific的想到了车险和寿险。
你说的保险市场两个问题(1,moral hazard不可避免的存在使保险公司没法区分potential投保人群;2,习惯是然,是中国人的索赔概率下降,以至premium更显不合理),正好说明中国保险市场(或者针对中国人的保险市场)之所以因为信息不对称所造成的market failure,所以chinese不是risk-taker至少不是irrational的risk taker或者中国人只是被price出了这个market。
| QUOTE (qcyshh @ 5 May 2005, 15:28) |
| 你说的保险市场两个问题(1,moral hazard不可避免的存在使保险公司没法区分potential投保人群;2,习惯是然,是中国人的索赔概率下降,以至premium更显不合理),正好说明中国保险市场(或者针对中国人的保险市场)之所以因为信息不对称所造成的market failure,所以chinese不是risk-taker至少不是irrational的risk taker或者中国人只是被price出了这个market。 |
?
risk taker这里有两个意思:
1。如果从保户角度讲,大家能不买就不买,风险自负
2。从保险商角度讲,尤其是竞争大的项目时候,历史上的“低索赔”造成擅自降低保费,以至费率过低没有办法再保,所以风险自负
我也不是学这科的,欢迎大家讨论
Moral hazard means that people with insurance may take greater risks than they would do without it because they know they are protected, so the insurer may get more claims than it bargained for.
LunJian.com
5 May 2005, 16:43
同意'Chinese are risk-takers'的说法。在老外看来,有这样的印象是因为:
1. 中国人是机会主义者。他们不愿按程序/法律办事,总想走捷径。如买车不上保险的,坐车逃票等等,侥幸心理很严重。
2. 中国人酷爱赌博。我去过几次赌场,里面的亚洲人面孔可真是多啊。他们一般都玩得很投入,不象一般老外玩得很放松,有说有笑的。
janesophie
5 May 2005, 23:26
| QUOTE (GISS @ 4 May 2005, 16:15) |
| QUOTE (janesophie @ 27 Apr 2005, 23:44) | | The fact that Chinese like gambling does not prove anything in terms of risk-attitude. How much you are willing to lose in comparison with your possession in a gamble should be the ultimate test for risk-attitude. |
麻烦解释一下
|
I was thinking about utility theory when I said that. The utility concept proposed by Berlouni, is comprised of a collection of individual subjective values and risk attitude. So for example, suppose that you are gambling in a simplest form, that is there is a urn with 50 red chips and 50 blue chips. You can take one chip out at a time with replacement, if you take out a red chip, then you get 100 pounds, if you take out a blue chip, then you get nothing. Then how much are you willing to pay for this gamble?
In that case, if you are willing to pay for more than 50 pounds for the gamble, then you are risk- taking, or risk-preferring.
I think I was misleading somehow in what I wrote there, sorry about that!
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